Super Eurobeat 214

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para_rigby
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Post by para_rigby » 01 May 2011, 14:50

Bore wrote:Bring back the radio edits and 18 tracks per album.
THANK YOU for agreeing with me on this subject. Extends tends to not add much of a special extra something to themselves. I don't really see the need for a 6 or 7 minute version of a eurobeat song.

Vadim
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Post by Vadim » 01 May 2011, 14:51

Bore wrote: Of course there are exceptions when the extendeds offer something actually new and different into the mix, but honestly those songs are simply too scarse. Bring back the radio edits and 18 tracks per album.
Our Fearless Leader has spoken...!!....

Going back to 18 radio edits can also help to relieve the pressures of track selection from so many labels......

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Post by DarkSky » 01 May 2011, 18:01

18 tracks will cause that labels will have to hurry a lot on making their music.. which is not good I guess.

drnrg
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Post by drnrg » 01 May 2011, 18:10

para_rigby
THANK YOU for agreeing with me on this subject. Extends tends to not add much of a special extra something to themselves. I don't really see the need for a 6 or 7 minute version of a eurobeat song.
It all depends if the label masters the SEB edit. But we are supporting them, so they might as well give us a real version in the tru spirit of classic Italo/90's Eurobeat and that is a creative mouthwatering extended version.

Here is a breakdown on SEB edits for each label.

TIME/Eurogrooves:,
I love them, but honestly thier SEB versions left much to the imaginations. Half of the song was the intro and that hidious fade out always pissed me off. That is how much I really loved this label's music and especially thier vocalists in order to overlook these atrocities

ABeatC
Like wise as terrible sounding at 4:00 edits. More fade outs and cuttting and pasting. SomeTIMES a Dave or Powerful T. song would feature a mini guitar breakdown, but rarely. I think Sunfire would sound the same at SEB extended. I can't even fathom Fire Dragon sounding any good at radio edit format.

HRG Attack
I have to admit that many TIMEs thier edits were very well made. They always added in a mini break at midpointt or just before the last synth riff and they never never use fade outs. Most of thier backcatalog is only about 4 to 4 mins and half and still sound like complete songs. Nowadays those same edits would hurt instead of help their songs. I can't imagine thier songs being less than 4:20 because of the lower bpms they are now using. Anything under that might as well just be a sample.

DELTA
Another label that mastered the edit perfectly. Good intro, no fade outs and always a mini break inbetween. It's odd; but Nowadays thier extendeds are not as good as the edits. It might be cuz Newfield is gone? I don't know? back in the day I purchaseed all thier vinyls just to hear those breakdowns.

Vibration/Dima
Anotherone of my favourite labels, but I hated thier edit format. Fade outs didn't help the matter. This one label that I practicaly purchased all the extendeds on Juno when they came out and somehow it gave the songs another life. I don't think Dima could pull of a 4:00 edit without losing a magor part of the song's essence. Try to imagine "Labrynth Of Love" or Bang Bang Cowboy at 3: 49-4:00 mins. Epic Fail.

SCP
I actually think this label writes thier songs with the 4 min version in mind , rather then composing an extended like HRG Attack and DELTA and then stripping it down to SEB edit, and it just seems plain lazy to me. I compare a song like "Sen Me An Angel" at it's 5:25 run TIME and then I hear "Samurai Blue" and it's no surprise why Momo is more popular than Go2 nowadyas. That song and "Invisible Touch" could have been classics, but niether of them even reaching the 4:00 min mark only hurt the songs. To top it off, now they are going as far as to strip away the intros they did in Ace's last song and I really hate that! That new "Boom Boom Scream" sounds like freaking preview of a song at its' pitifull 3:49, but then I got my hands on that 6:00 plus extended and totally fell in love with it. Now that's a SONG! Hotblade's debut song was anotherone that left much to the imagination, but I got my hands on the Instrumental version and I rectified that problem right away making my own 6:00 version. :D

I can't compare GGMs nor Sinclaire Style cuz they jumped the train when extended format came out. I don't think I would notice GGMs too much, but I bet that killer guitar breakdown from "Wheel Power & Go" would end up on the cutting room floor and that just won't do.

Maybe that breakdown will change some members' minds? Or maybe not? Some even go as far as to say they prefer nonstops. Remeber Euromach? That was probobly AVEX best marketable stragety, cuz I was out their searching for extendeds when I heard those freaking previews of the songs. but anyway, you all know where I stand?
Extendeds all the way.

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Post by Danko » 01 May 2011, 20:26

I too prefer Extended all the way! It makes songs much better and more intresting! :)

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Bore
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Post by Bore » 01 May 2011, 21:26

DarkSky wrote:18 tracks will cause that labels will have to hurry a lot on making their music.. which is not good I guess.
Even with ~13 tracks per album, there's hardly ever a lot of great material on an seb. Most of us have very specific styles we want to hear on the albums, with only a few people totally digging all labels and all styles. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd wager most want a high number of label X or Y per album, with 13 tracks and multiple labels the quantity is pretty low. I can right away say that I would prefer lots of Delta/GGM at the expense of other labels, someone else would pick SCP or HRG. Even at the danger of losing quality.

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Post by drnrg » 01 May 2011, 22:27

Bore
I can right away say that I would prefer lots of Delta/GGM at the expense of other labels, someone else would pick SCP or HRG. Even at the danger of losing quality.
I would hardly pick those two labels as examples of losing quality. It's those two and Dima studios that are, in fact pushing the envelope now adays. I actually wouldn't mind SEB totally dropping Saifam. Right now I got my eye on what Sinclaire can cook up next. Lately he has been giving his male sung songs the royal treatment and that shows alot of promise.

I actually enjoy the variety on SEB. Especially vols like 208 and 211.I'm not gonna lie. I do someTIMES prefer the current Super Duper volumes to SEBs, but I don't think we be losing any quality if Saiam got the axe and AVEX pressured Sinclaire and SunFire to produce more music. and Eurogrooves is great, but I can't take anymore healing, so if GGMs can provide another Manuel track, let's stick it in there too.

The quality will be lost with 18 SEB edits.

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Post by Vadim » 01 May 2011, 22:51

To be honest, I never really believed in existance of the Quality Problem with eurobeat teams....They actually record and mix much better than majority of contemporary commercial dance producers, and do it pretty fast too...

Avex never understood what a treasure chest they are sitting on...

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Post by Bore » 01 May 2011, 22:55

Agreed with Vadim. And well drnrg the forenamed labels were just examples, we all have our own favorites and they collide quite frequently. And for that reason I feel that a higher quantity of songs caters a wider audience. Plus online stores are way more frequent these days, could have extendeds on iTunes and the likes.

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Post by Gorgia_v » 01 May 2011, 23:24

drnrg i love reading what you say as it is usually pretty damn accurate

but are you saying because songs like invisible touch are not classics because of their length or not as good because they dont run 6mins??

i see that as your preference but seriously the length of a song will not make it a hit or miss....look as Blur's "Song 2" with a length of 2:02 i am pretty sure everyone here would know it making it a classic. (now i know blur isnt eurobeat)

So using euromach as an example, i fell in love with i would say atleast 90% of euromach and they are all still on my ipod playlist they are all nonstop format and run pretty close to about 2:30, however the SCP special collections i got from itunes are now not on my playlist because i dont care for them as a lengthy song. but this is my preference as is the song length for you
its great that you have a preference for lengthy songs, but to some here it doesnt matter as long as the song is good, the lyrics are powerful and or catchy we are happy.....that said.....Can we please get off the length topic, or you could go start a new thread based on song length and leave this to the actual topic in question....SEB214

Gorgia_v
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Post by Gorgia_v » 01 May 2011, 23:35

Bore wrote:Agreed with Vadim. And well drnrg the forenamed labels were just examples, we all have our own favorites and they collide quite frequently. And for that reason I feel that a higher quantity of songs caters a wider audience. Plus online stores are way more frequent these days, could have extendeds on iTunes and the likes.
well said bore, myself lately have not had any interest in HRG untill the last few albums with slower bpm and synth, not sop crazy melodies and all make me wanna listen to hrg more...songs like intercooler totally turned me off HRG, but then sometimes dare i say it some lolita songs drive me nuts and i skip the track the moment the track starts, othertimes i only want to listen to lolita...i wouldnt say i have a chosen eurobeat label or artst. because they all bring something special to the table....

that said i am totally over Saifam and their Dancemania Speed style tracks that are in no way close to eurobeat in anyway...but i guess 7A are trying to get a get a western feel to the albums...for reasons we dont know, could be a "western trend" who know what avex are thinking...however if avex put the saifam version of Pokerface or any gaga song i will cry and never by a SEB again!! :grin: :grin:

drnrg
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Post by drnrg » 02 May 2011, 00:14

Gorgia_v
but are you saying because songs like invisible touch are not classics because of their length or not as good because they dont run 6mins??

i see that as your preference but seriously the length of a song will not make it a hit or miss....look as Blur's "Song 2" with a length of 2:02 i am pretty sure everyone here would know it making it a classic. (now i know blur isnt eurobeat)
Not really. I did point out that certain labels have mastered the edit, DELTA, HRG Attack and SCP. I still think Invisible Touch could have been better if it pushed the 5 min mark and It's probobly the fact that I grew up in the extended vinyl TIMEframe that I prefer longer songs. The breakdown really gives the label a chance to play around with the synths and come up with something extra especial. . Remeber DELTA Queens- Dance Around The World Montrous in Extended. Crap in edit. BTW ,I recall everyone creaming over the DELTA E.B Masters compilatiuons in extended ,so to a degree I must have a point.


Blurr is another genre, so it doesn't apply. BTW, great song. I also remeber Tainted Love- Soft Cell was rather short too. Another classic.

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Post by the_ditz » 02 May 2011, 10:07

drnrg wrote:BTW ,I recall everyone creaming over the DELTA E.B Masters compilatiuons in extended ,so to a degree I must have a point.

Blurr is another genre, so it doesn't apply. BTW, great song. I also remeber Tainted Love- Soft Cell was rather short too. Another classic.
I creamed over Eurobeat Masters becuase it had new unreleased tracks, not because they were extended. In fact, I was pretty disappointed when they released virtually a whole volume of tracks that had already featured on recent SEB releases (was it vol. 18?) as that was a missed opportunity to get more new music out there.

We all seem to come from different musical upbringings, which is probably why there are always these debates about song length. I think what Bore suggested of having the 18 track SEB edits on disc, and then extended versions available for purchase in online music stores is the best compromise. However, I do worry that this would signal the end of physical CD's, especially if Avex were to strike a deal with a digital music store that could offer lossless quality...

Anyway, I'm pretty happy with the way the series is now (aside from the final remix on each disc - for me, that's just wasting precious space that could be occupied with another new track!)

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Post by Lebon14 » 02 May 2011, 10:18

Danko wrote:I too prefer Extended all the way! It makes songs much better and more intresting! :)
All yeah!! You've got my back too! *points "Mad Desire" by Stephy Martini*
椛ちゃん、助けてぇぇぇぇぇ!

Vadim
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Post by Vadim » 02 May 2011, 12:42

Extended or not...bottom line is still the music being fit for a decent eurobeat compilation...

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