Spread the Beat

Everything that is eurobeat can be discussed here.
Wataru Akiyama
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Post by Wataru Akiyama » 10 Jun 2014, 02:09

Gruzky wrote:. You're not gonna have Ace Warrior's newest track being played on the speed channel or at racing events/car shows, and you sure as shit are not gonna start hearing Eurobeat being played on mainstream radio and consistently showing up on the Billboard charts lol.
This is more of a problem of capital.

It's already well known that most of the Mainstream Radio Noise is produced factory-style by corporate suits who decide what we should apparently be listening to.

Eurobeat is outside of the Corporate Sphere. There is no Eurobeat division at Warner, at Sony Records, at Universal, and I'm pretty sure that the Suits don't want to hear about Eurobeat, mostly because there's not much of a profit to be turned in it. There's profit, but you can't just pump out Eurobeat acts like the way they pump out Alt-Rock bands - eurobeat is difficult and specific.

If you were helming a billion-dollar company and took the Eurobeat studios under your wing with record deals and such, we very likely WOULD turn on our radios and hear Eurobeat.

Eurobeat artists and studios aren't profit-obsessed drones who chase Capital, however, so I don't expect them to 'sell out' even if one of the Mainstream Music Machine corporations offered them something.

You say Eurobeat is fringe-type music for underground people, and I have to agree; I even think that the studios and artists are free-spirited people like the listeners who mostly go against the grain and do things unconventionally - the price they pay for this is obscurity and the sad fact that you don't, as you mentioned, get to hear Eurobeat in movies, TV shows, and on the radio. Which is really sad.
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eXtaticus
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Post by eXtaticus » 10 Jun 2014, 02:14

-redacted-
Last edited by eXtaticus on 19 Dec 2017, 23:39, edited 1 time in total.

Wataru Akiyama
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Post by Wataru Akiyama » 10 Jun 2014, 02:18

eXtaticus wrote:>implying avex aren't "corporate suits"

Also, your formula-driven four-on-the-floor dance music that hit its peak in an era in which A-Beat C must have been producing at least one new track every week ISN'T "produced factory-style"?

I don't really understand what there is to be gained from keeping eurobeat under the radar, other than the fact that it clearly makes you guys feel good for liking something perceived to be "obscure".
8) I love being obscure, bro.

I'm a fringe-type dude - I watch chinese cartoons and listen to music made in Italy for Japanese people.

But anyway. No, I hate the fact that Eurobeat isn't mainstream.

However, Avex barely ranks as a corporate entity. Compared to Universal or Warner Music, Avex barely even exists.
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otter87
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Post by otter87 » 10 Jun 2014, 02:38

Wataru Akiyama wrote:
Gruzky wrote:. You're not gonna have Ace Warrior's newest track being played on the speed channel or at racing events/car shows, and you sure as shit are not gonna start hearing Eurobeat being played on mainstream radio and consistently showing up on the Billboard charts lol.
This is more of a problem of capital.

It's already well known that most of the Mainstream Radio Noise is produced factory-style by corporate suits who decide what we should apparently be listening to.

Eurobeat is outside of the Corporate Sphere. There is no Eurobeat division at Warner, at Sony Records, at Universal, and I'm pretty sure that the Suits don't want to hear about Eurobeat, mostly because there's not much of a profit to be turned in it. There's profit, but you can't just pump out Eurobeat acts like the way they pump out Alt-Rock bands - eurobeat is difficult and specific.

If you were helming a billion-dollar company and took the Eurobeat studios under your wing with record deals and such, we very likely WOULD turn on our radios and hear Eurobeat.

Eurobeat artists and studios aren't profit-obsessed drones who chase Capital, however, so I don't expect them to 'sell out' even if one of the Mainstream Music Machine corporations offered them something.

You say Eurobeat is fringe-type music for underground people, and I have to agree; I even think that the studios and artists are free-spirited people like the listeners who mostly go against the grain and do things unconventionally - the price they pay for this is obscurity and the sad fact that you don't, as you mentioned, get to hear Eurobeat in movies, TV shows, and on the radio. Which is really sad.
Dude, Eurobeat is the exact same way. It is capable of being produced on a gigantic scale, as it was in the past. And the possibility of countless artists (actual different people, not just aliases) is very much possible. Eurobeat definitely has a factory, methodic aspect to its production. It's not that different from any mainstream music aside from its sound.

And that is the reason it will never reach widespread popularity. The lyrics are corny and nonsensical. The actual music is childish and yet marketed towards adults (lyrical themes). And to be quite honest, the people behind Eurobeat's public relation skills are... not normal. The flamboyant nature of most of the artist's personas (think Dave Rodgers or Go 2) are not something the average American is gonna wanna see from a grown man. It's more reminiscent of something you would see from some boy band aimed at pre-teens like One Direction. It might pass with people who are used to stuff like that from the animes they watch, but it's not gonna fly with your typical football watching, manly man American. And your every-girl is not gonna choose SEB over the newest party track

Wataru Akiyama
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Post by Wataru Akiyama » 10 Jun 2014, 03:10

Gruzky wrote: Dude, Eurobeat is the exact same way. It is capable of being produced on a gigantic scale, as it was in the past. And the possibility of countless artists (actual different people, not just aliases) is very much possible. Eurobeat definitely has a factory, methodic aspect to its production. It's not that different from any mainstream music aside from its sound.

And that is the reason it will never reach widespread popularity. The lyrics are corny and nonsensical. The actual music is childish and yet marketed towards adults (lyrical themes). And to be quite honest, the people behind Eurobeat's public relation skills are... not normal. The flamboyant nature of most of the artist's personas (think Dave Rodgers or Go 2) are not something the average American is gonna wanna see from a grown man. It's more reminiscent of something you would see from some boy band aimed at pre-teens like One Direction. It might pass with people who are used to stuff like that from the animes they watch, but it's not gonna fly with your typical football watching, manly man American. And your every-girl is not gonna choose SEB over the newest party track

If Justin Bieber, the Coolest Kid In The World, can act 'flamboyant' while singing "BABY BABY" over a pre-recorded synthline, to thunderous applause, then there's no reason why Mainstream America wouldn't listen to Go 2.

There's an audience in America for Eurobeat; you just have to delegate someone to go tell Warner, Sony, or Universal Records about it. It's my belief, as I mentioned earlier, that the Eurobeat production studios purposefully avoid making contact with them.

I don't blame them. The suits ruin everything they touch.
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para_rigby
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Post by para_rigby » 10 Jun 2014, 03:38

American pop and dance has terribly corny lyrics...#Selfie, anyone?

Mindsweeper
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Post by Mindsweeper » 10 Jun 2014, 03:49

Guys I think we should all listen to Bonkers.

You are never going to hear Hardstyle, UK Hardcore or say, Psytrance on mainstream radio, yet these genres all have sizable fanbases and aren't in danger of dying out like eurobeat is. We need to get eurobeat playing alongside other speedy fun genres in the rave scene. Avex being dickheads about licensing doesn't help at all, obviously.
eXtaticus wrote: I don't really understand what there is to be gained from keeping eurobeat under the radar, other than the fact that it clearly makes you guys feel good for liking something perceived to be "obscure".
Oh yeah, I fucking love having exactly one person in real life who sorta gets my dumb eurobeat jokes, and having no one to seriously talk to about it. I especially love dancing parapara alone in my room 361 days a year, give or take depending on whether the anime convention I go to has any para events.

Just because we don't want eurobeat to become pop-ified and poop-ified doesn't mean we want to stay in absolute soul-crushing obscurity forever because it makes us feel like soopar speshul snowflaex

Wataru Akiyama
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Post by Wataru Akiyama » 10 Jun 2014, 03:49

para_rigby wrote:American pop and dance has terribly corny lyrics...#Selfie, anyone?
Yeah, and Rihanna or Miley or whoever saying "FUCK FUCK FUCK" and humping a phallic object suuuuuuure isn't corny or childish.

:D

I'm gonna be honest and say that I don't want Eurobeat to go mainstream only because then I'm gonna hear it in an advertisement for something lame, like Walmart.

And that's just gonna suck. Other than that, yeah, Euro + mass media might be pretty cool. It wouldn't change my life meaningfully, but it would be cool. :|

Mostly, I'm just upset that it isn't like when you could go into a club and people would be dancing to Eurobeat.
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otter87
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Post by otter87 » 10 Jun 2014, 04:34

para_rigby wrote:American pop and dance has terribly corny lyrics...#Selfie, anyone?
that song is satirical, you can't honestly pretend you don't realize that.
Wataru Akiyama wrote: Yeah, and Rihanna or Miley or whoever saying "FUCK FUCK FUCK" and humping a phallic object suuuuuuure isn't corny or childish.
It's not childish, its sexual. Immature, maybe, but it's what is in.

Cows and Japanese culture, on the other hand, are not things your average 20-something year old American wants to hear in the song they are listening to in the car with their friends on the way to a party to get wasted after playing beer pong.

And I can guarantee you they don't wanna see people like Ace making voodoo hand gestures in his music videos, that's something straight out of a cheesy 60's horror film.

Eurobeat vocalists and producers are not exactly the "coolest" or "hippest" people. And that is probably the main reason they will never be successful in the US. America is not going to fall in love with this:

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or this

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These are cheesy attempts at looking cool or tough, and I'm sorry to sound like a hater, but they are laughable. I don't know why some of you guys put Eurobeat and Eurobeat artists/producers on some sort of pedestal. Just take it for what it is. It IS fun and catchy. It ISN'T the next things you're gonna see blow up at all the clubs.

It works in Japan because the Japanese are quirky as shit to begin with and they are used to this type of strangeness. Americans aren't, and trust me, they will never warm up to it. It's too flamboyant and it's just not up to American standards of what a celebrity should look and act like.
Wataru Akiyama wrote:I don't want Eurobeat to go mainstream only because then I'm gonna hear it in an advertisement for something lame, like Walmart.
Don't worry, you wont.
Last edited by otter87 on 27 Sep 2018, 01:46, edited 1 time in total.

Bonkers
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Post by Bonkers » 10 Jun 2014, 05:00

I think what I fail to understand is how many of you are trying to compare the possible marketing potential of Eurobeat to that of American dance-pop marketing.

America, for one, has NEVER been the market for commercial electronic dance music. Period. PERIOD! P-E-R-I-O-D! The 80s sparked the New Wave dance that blossomed in both Europe and the States. That gave away in the 90s when Eurodance became the "it" genre for mainstream media. EVERYTHING had to be eurodance! That worked great until American media circuits did their best, and succeeded, at stomping out the eurodance craze in favor of American-mad boy bands, pop divas, soul artists, and rappers. It suddenly became accepted to look down upon the dance music lovers (also, during this time, the rave scene was booming in the States, so other underground dance genres like Hard Trance, Happy Hardcore, Hard house, techno were building the underground scene that most people had no idea of unless you went to an actual rave).

All this was exactly how the record companies wanted. The only commercial dance music would be club extended remixes of pop songs...maybe a eurodance (now just vocal trance) thrown in here and there to keep it spicy. This has been the formula ever since. That was until Lady Gaga appeared on the circuit with her "Just Dance" trance-influenced "dance pop" sound. She became, and still is, an icon for the American club sound. David Guetta, Tiesto, Armin Van Burren quickly saw potential in this and picked up on the bandwagon. Their reputable names would bring in the crowd and boost CD/Download sales for this rehashed, "dance remixes of pop tracks" formula. And that's what we're left with currently.

So, in the States, you have the mainstream club circuit, full of your electro-house, trance, house, dubstep genres consisting mostly of remixed material. You also have the rave circuit, boasting a wide-genre; mostly foreign following: Happy Hardcore, UK Hardcore, Hardstyle, Hard Trance, Drum'n'Bass, dubstep, goa trance, psytrance, Hard Dance/NRG, UK Hard House, techno, etc.

As for the data on Happy Hardcore music sales in the States: "The first Happy2bHardcore release in 1997 sold 100,000 copies, a staggering number fo the genre. Over it’s lifetime, the series has sold over 400,000 CDs."

#1 Best Selling Electronic Music CD – Happy 2b Hardcore Chapter 1″
Nielson Soundscan (I would say this was honored circa 1997).

That number in CD sales for all 7 volumes is AMAZING for an underground genre that wasn't even produced in the States! NO commercials, No Advertising. Sales were strictly from creating a fan base (Candy Ravers) around the genre in the North American rave scene. And.....there is NO FACE image of the vocalists (except for Darren Styles & Re-Con). Except for a few dutch titles, there are no music videos for HHC. So ya...that's something Eurobeat & HHC share.

Eurobeat can see that potential if DJs would start playing it out instead of only playing Eurobeat at anime cons. People need to hear, experience, feel, be one with this genre by actually hearing it for what it is...dance music. Chaotic dance music. Music that breaks the rules. Music that has its own identity. Start holding your own parties! Most cities have rental venues. Rent one out, blast this genre over the sound system. Once you hook people, they are gonna want more, and that's where you build in your sales.

Gruzky...you are so fixated on Eurobeat fitting an image of the typical American. Stop focusing on trying to make Eurobeat fit this image. Its negative. Eurobeat's fan base is going to be within in the underground, just as it is in Japan. WHY would you even want the "typical American" in on this music? Like I said, it would only be reformed to fit the what would be deemed acceptable to the popular crowd. Let people COME TO THE MUSIC! Just like you did! Just like I did! Just like everyone on this forum did!
Last edited by Bonkers on 10 Jun 2014, 05:19, edited 1 time in total.

Mindsweeper
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Post by Mindsweeper » 10 Jun 2014, 05:13

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ this this this seriously you guys
Gruzky wrote:

These are cheesy attempts at looking cool or tough, and I'm sorry to sound like a hater, but they are laughable.
Man I thought everyone was on the same level with that, no one is arguing that it's anything more than fun in a silly b-movie kind of way right?

But like...

Am I the only one who thinks Ace and Fastway are pretty hot? Hotness is great for promotion ಠ◡ಠ


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obby

Bonkers
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Post by Bonkers » 10 Jun 2014, 05:35

On the contrary, I did find this Japanese TV ad for Bonkers Vol.1 (released in 1996)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipD-iSVQjRc

drnrg
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Post by drnrg » 10 Jun 2014, 05:37

Gruzky
Eurobeat vocalists and producers are not exactly the "coolest" or "hippest" people. And that is probably the main reason they will never be successful in the US. America is not going to fall in love with this:
I understand what you are trying to say and for the record, I also NEVER would want Eurobeat to go mainstream, but the arguments you present are not fair. Especially to Eurobeat. You post that pic of David Dima and (is That Mauro) and say they are cheeesy and not cool. Shame on you. have you forgotten the stupidity of Vanilla Ice or M.C. Hammer? Oh Yeah, they were real cool :D or how about the stupid gang signs thrown at you from 50 cent and Dr Dre ect... That was so cool that they even started to kill each other off. If you want silly stupid music; listen to Jason Derulo- Wiggle or better yet just take a look at the Billboard top 100. Some body already beat me to it, but #SELFIE? Really? Is that what music has come down to? This is why I follow the new Indie/alt/Rock movement. At least there is some light at the end of the tunnel with good music from Ed Sheeran, Bastille, Neon Trees. I say that, so you don't think I hate all Pop, cuz I don't. Kelly Clarkson and Demi Lovato are two of my favourite pop artists.

...and I'll tell you something else, and its a shame ,but what seems to be cool with this era's generation is straight out sexual & satanic images . Katy Perry being burned at the stake during the grammy's for her horrible demonized "Dark Horse" junk of a song. Or Jay Z and Beyonce conjuring demons during thier presentation. How about Lady Gaga being vomited upon by some loser who conciders that a form of art? Mily Cyrus slapping her privates during her concerts.I'm not saying all American's like this, but its a shame what the music industry pushes onto younsters now adays and conciders cool. and it's all over the world. U.K and Canada are following the same trail.

I'm sorry, but I'll take the image of any X eurobeat starr over that anyday. At least they are having fun with it. ...and what the hell is wrong with Dave Rodger's image?

You are making a rather general staement saying that American's will shun Eurobeat cuz of thier image. It's never been about thier image. It's just that the U.S. music industry still isn't ready for fast melodic music consisting of Synthesisers and hyped vocals. They tried it in the late 80's with High Energy, but got tired of it real quick. They tried slowing it down with Latin Freestyle and same result.

I really don'y know who picks out what songs are to become hits, but many TIMEs I envision the industry BigWigs playing jokes on the public for fun and choosing the worst garbage possible for laughs just to see if the public will respond? "Blurred lines", "Fancy" "Talk Dirty To Me"? These songs have got to be jokes :P

Wataru Akiyama
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Post by Wataru Akiyama » 10 Jun 2014, 05:52

Bonkers wrote: Start holding your own parties! Most cities have rental venues. Rent one out, blast this genre over the sound system. Once you hook people, they are gonna want more, and that's where you build in your sales.
Good idea! I'm gonna do this.

How do I get people to come inside the venue, though? Will they come automatically? Do I have to put up flyers saying "BIG RAVE PARTY!!!" or what?
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Wataru Akiyama
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Post by Wataru Akiyama » 10 Jun 2014, 05:55

drnrg wrote:Gruzky
Eurobeat vocalists and producers are not exactly the "coolest" or "hippest" people. And that is probably the main reason they will never be successful in the US. America is not going to fall in love with this:
I understand what you are trying to say and for the record, I also NEVER would want Eurobeat to go mainstream, but the arguments you present are not fair. Especially to Eurobeat. You post that pic of David Dima and (is That Mauro) and say they are cheeesy and not cool. Shame on you. have you forgotten the stupidity of Vanilla Ice or M.C. Hammer? Oh Yeah, they were real cool :D or how about the stupid gang signs thrown at you from 50 cent and Dr Dre ect... That was so cool that they even started to kill each other off. If you want silly stupid music; listen to Jason Derulo- Wiggle or better yet just take a look at the Billboard top 100. Some body already beat me to it, but #SELFIE? Really? Is that what music has come down to? This is why I follow the new Indie/alt/Rock movement. At least there is some light at the end of the tunnel with good music from Ed Sheeran, Bastille, Neon Trees. I say that, so you don't think I hate all Pop, cuz I don't. Kelly Clarkson and Demi Lovato are two of my favourite pop artists.

...and I'll tell you something else, and its a shame ,but what seems to be cool with this era's generation is straight out sexual & satanic images . Katy Perry being burned at the stake during the grammy's for her horrible demonized "Dark Horse" junk of a song. Or Jay Z and Beyonce conjuring demons during thier presentation. How about Lady Gaga being vomited upon by some loser who conciders that a form of art? Mily Cyrus slapping her privates during her concerts.I'm not saying all American's like this, but its a shame what the music industry pushes onto younsters now adays and conciders cool. and it's all over the world. U.K and Canada are following the same trail.

I'm sorry, but I'll take the image of any X eurobeat starr over that anyday. At least they are having fun with it. ...and what the hell is wrong with Dave Rodger's image?

You are making a rather general staement saying that American's will shun Eurobeat cuz of thier image. It's never been about thier image. It's just that the U.S. music industry still isn't ready for fast melodic music consisting of Synthesisers and hyped vocals. They tried it in the late 80's with High Energy, but got tired of it real quick. They tried slowing it down with Latin Freestyle and same result.

I really don'y know who picks out what songs are to become hits, but many TIMEs I envision the industry BigWigs playing jokes on the public for fun and choosing the worst garbage possible for laughs just to see if the public will respond? "Blurred lines", "Fancy" "Talk Dirty To Me"? These songs have got to be jokes :P
+1

What this man said! WHAT THIS MAN SAID!
drnrg wrote:
I really don'y know who picks out what songs are to become hits, but many TIMEs I envision the industry BigWigs playing jokes on the public for fun and choosing the worst garbage possible for laughs just to see if the public will respond? "Blurred lines", "Fancy" "Talk Dirty To Me"? These songs have got to be jokes :P
The Suits are to blame for this.

drnrg wrote:...and I'll tell you something else, and its a shame ,but what seems to be cool with this era's generation is straight out sexual & satanic images . Katy Perry being burned at the stake during the grammy's for her horrible demonized "Dark Horse" junk of a song. Or Jay Z and Beyonce conjuring demons during thier presentation. How about Lady Gaga being vomited upon by some loser who conciders that a form of art? Mily Cyrus slapping her privates during her concerts.I'm not saying all American's like this, but its a shame what the music industry pushes onto younsters now adays and conciders cool. and it's all over the world. U.K and Canada are following the same trail.
A number of sociologists have been tracking this phenomenon. I'm glad to see you're aware of this issue. It's been attracting quite a lot of attention from many circles.
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