SPECULATION: SEB's ending at 200? Or not?

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zoupzuop2
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SPECULATION: SEB's ending at 200? Or not?

Post by zoupzuop2 » 22 Jul 2008, 19:10

A thread to end the derailings.

That inevitable question of "Will Super Eurobeat end at vol. 200" is worthy of discussion, but the topic keeps ending up derailing threads (much like the ABeatC hatred did some time back). So, I'm moving it here, pseudo-officially.

Evidence/Considerations FOR the ending of Super Eurobeat ending at 200:
*Management has shifted frequently during the recent decades.
*Most changes have been made to keep the series afloat-- however, this only serves to alienate the audience, which continues to distance itself from Avex for that reason.
*Sales have decreased a great deal since the "internet revolution of music" has hit-- and their motion to jump on that bandwagon came FAR too late.
*Avex's iron fist in what kinds of tracks it accepts continue to alienate its own labels.
*200 would be a VERY notable milestone to end on, establishing its place as one of the world's longest-running Dance music compilations ever. Besides, why stretch a compilation further when it's already ceasing to be profitable?

Evidence/Considerations AGAINST the 200 SEB Ending:
*Never have there been so many labels on Super Eurobeat. Why bother putting so many on all of a sudden, unless as some sort of bizarre swan song?
*With their recent move to online sources, Avex is no longer in the "dark ages" of music releases for profit. If they play their cards right online, they should be able to make this work for them.
*As attention increases slightly as the numbers creep towards 200, wouldn't they want to take advantage of the publicity and popularity and keep it going? (Hint: More Niko tracks would get even MORE attention!)
*Eurobeat artists are beginning to do live shows in what could be considered the second-most frequency as their heyday in the 90's and early 2000's. Why waste that publicity?

My thoughts:
*Parapara and Eurobeat are getting more and more attention in other countries than Japan... and most of these audiences are at LEAST somewhat aware of the compilation, Super Eurobeat, to begin with. Why cut the power?
*Perhaps if Avex realized they're alienating people in all directions, they'd loosen their grip on the producers and lighten up on the fans, reviving a currently lukewarm audience.
*REGARDLESS of if Super Eurobeat goes beyond 200, the labels MUST do their own publicity legwork to have any longevity. Fresh, young, "hip" talent (or at least unique enough to catch attention); their OWN, Eurobeat-specific websites; Youtube content; studio information; iTunes or Juno downloads; artist/musician/producer bios... whatever labels can do to boost their own specific attentions in the public's eye, will boost their success (along with SEB's if it's running at that point in time).
*The death of Super Eurobeat wouldn't mean the death of Eurobeat as a genre; it would depend on how the labels react/respond after Avex ceases production. If the labels did NOT know how to continue after Avex, then, yes, they'd most likely suffer to the point of their own destruction. They would have to pool together and create, say, their own compilation, or resort to another distributor. Even beyond that, even if the most current of Eurobeat labels find itself "dead", there will always be that catalyst of creators sprinkled in the world to take matters into their own hands. Hell, if the creators in this forum ALONE pulled together and churned out releases, the genre itself would not die. All Eurobeat would be doing is losing one of its biggest distributors-- which, if any other record label in the WORLD (read: Farm, Warner, Sony, Universal, EMI...) were interested in keeping the genre alive (and marketable), would not be a problem.

Even if SEB dies, Eurobeat won't. That's what I think.

Discuss away.
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Post by Lebon14 » 22 Jul 2008, 20:54

Question : Why is Warner in bold?

Beside, I think Avec has been putting on SEB more good songs with the 180 decade that on 170 & 160 reunited. So, I don't think it's the end at 200. Just wait & see.

But the speculation says that it's a young manager would take the lead starting at 191... I hope she will make a turn in the history of SEB (For the best)
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Post by drnrg » 23 Jul 2008, 01:39

I don't even know if I should add fuel to this fire. First off, it doesn't cost millions to put out a Eurobeat compliation. Second of all , most of Eurobeat labels are backed up by producing other dance music. Especially AVEX who dwell in all sorts of genres. Third of all ,Avex is always releasing nonstop compilations packed with Eurobeat classics; which I'm pretty sure compensate them for any losses. They could however, add more variety of songs, instead of the same overused trax over & Over. Four:Producers like Newfield and others compensate thier income by selling extended on Juno and Itunes. Five: of all it's an established genre which has gone on for years and will allways have a willing and supportive community. Last ,but not least it opens up the public to new and exciting vocalists, who otherwise might not get a chance to shine. I'm also speaking about composers.

Reasons to stop: NONE ABSOLUTLY NONE

I mean why even raise uncertaintly about Eurobeat, if you are happy with it? That milestone thing you mention is a copout. Instead of comming up with good reasons to end it(Which thier are none at all :evil: ) Why not raise the question, what would or could we do if we were faced with this GOD forbidden senairio?

To end all this negativity and I say this, because if I were a Eurobeat producer or alumni in Eurobeat buisness, I would ask myself, why are the fans suddenly thinking this? Are we doing something wrong? Are they not happy with Eurobeat? Lets just be happy AVEX and all these lables are producing The music which I believe all of us here love.

As far as I'm concerned there is nothing wrong at all. The labels are stronger than ever, the're are more lables. They are experimenting more. Like you mentioned more recognition and promotion. If anything Avex should start up a new series while SEB is running. Establish it with the new generation....and by this I mean a second cd with videos or maybe even Nonstop (other genre dance). though;I for one, don't like to spend money on anything other than Eurobeat. IDK Maybe even put it out on a tri monthly basis? I can still forgive that, but in that case I would want my 18 tracks back and not in Mix formatt.

I know you have this secret desire for Eurobeat to cross over to the states and become huge, but like I already mentioned 1000 of TIMES, Every genre the U.S. touches; it kills off, so no! Eurobeat stays where it's at. With a small cult following, but with it's most diehard fan following.

All these negative predictions or "reality" as some of you say, are nothing ,but bad vibes that produce a big ugly cloud of doubt over the community.

We are going to be in a small hiatus from any nw Eurobeat materials for a few months and I sure hope these are not the kinda topics that will be brought up?

Hopefully this new younger director will put in the TIME and effort to keep the genre strong, but I know for a fact that AVEX does not rely on Eurobeat for thier sole profit, so I doubt they will be as heartless to "stick it to the fans" in such an ugly manner.

Here is my prediction: Eurobeat going on till I die, or at least untill I'm senile enough, that I won't notice it's absenmce :P

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Post by #Infinity » 23 Jul 2008, 02:48

I full-on support drnrg's argument.
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Post by Jay » 23 Jul 2008, 03:47

drnrg wrote:First off, it doesn't cost millions to put out a Eurobeat compliation.
Well, it certainly costs a lot more than a few hundred dollars to create thousands of copies.

The whole process in creating a compilation totals to about $10,000-$15,000 USD depending on how many copies Avex creates. And nobody knows exactly how much Avex reimburses the labels for each production they license, so that isn't considered into the equation... I'm sure it adds a considerable amount to that figure though.

Avex loses a LOT from illegal downloading. One BT tracker I looked at showed one compilation from the 170s being downloaded over 3,000 times. That's a $60,000+ net loss for Avex for ONE compilation from ONE BT tracker. I'm unsure about how many people actually buy the CDs, but I believe dtan once said that only about 2,500-3,000 people buy the 'non-decade' albums. I'm sure Avex is still making a profit, but not as considerable as before the torrent and p2p phenomenon.

So the question is: Just how much can Avex bare to lose before they eventually pull the curtain on the series?
drnrg wrote:To end all this negativity and I say this, because if I were a Eurobeat producer or alumni in Eurobeat buisness, I would ask myself, why are the fans suddenly thinking this? Are we doing something wrong? Are they not happy with Eurobeat? Lets just be happy AVEX and all these lables are producing The music which I believe all of us here love.
I was irked by this comment. I certainly do NOT feel Avex should pull the series because of my personal feelings about certain labels, producers or vocalists. The labels tend to enter high and low phases at different points in the SEB series and I acknowledge that they'll eventually drag themselves out of the slump. But that doesn't hold water in this topic. I'm showing genuine concern for the state of the series as there are many elements working against Avex, both financially and internally. We're all hoping they'll pull through and the SEB series will continue, but as zuopzoup pointed out, it's better to end on a high note than a low note. If that's what it boils down to then I don't mind at all.
drnrg wrote:Here is my prediction: Eurobeat going on till I die, or at least untill I'm senile enough, that I won't notice it's absenmce
Again, the topic is whether or not the Super Eurobeat series should end, NOT the genre. Eurobeat is not going to die if the SEB series ends. There will always be other avenues the labels will take in order to get their music heard. Heck, it could even be replaced with another series from a different company. Who knows?

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Post by zoupzuop2 » 23 Jul 2008, 04:47

Lebon14 wrote:Question : Why is Warner in bold?
Mm. If I recall right, Warner really pushed compilations with Akyr's music on it. While I'm not sure if Akyr is dead or just in hiatus, it's clear that Warner doesn't regard Eurobeat to be dead if it's dealt with Akyr this recently. It's a HUGE label, pretty much the same size as Avex. (And, remember that Warner ALSO has ties in many many countries, whereas Avex seems a lot more focused on Japan and its nearby-s.)

As well, I NEVER said Eurobeat would die. In fact, I said the opposite:
The death of Super Eurobeat wouldn't mean the death of Eurobeat as a genre; it would depend on how the labels react/respond after Avex ceases production.
It'd only die if EVERY LABEL THAT IS PRODUCING IT died out or otherwise stopped making it. And that, my friend, would be impossible. None of us would allow it. If it so depended on it, I imagine that Mikaeru, RainbowDragonEyes, myself and EVERYONE ELSE HERE who's even CONTRIBUTED to making fan-made songs would pull together and keep it going. Got it? ;3

No genre dying. Just its largest distributor, which, depending on how labels react/counteract, either does a lot or otherwise.
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Post by #Infinity » 23 Jul 2008, 04:54

I will CRY if the Super Eurobeat series ends at 200 and nothing succeeds it, and it's certainly the last thing I want to be thinking about at the moment.

I hate this thread already. Moving on? :???:
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Post by Lebon14 » 23 Jul 2008, 05:20

#Infinity wrote:I will CRY if the Super Eurobeat series ends at 200 and nothing succeeds it, and it's certainly the last thing I want to be thinking about at the moment.

I hate this thread already. Moving on? :???:
OMG... me too.
And, I also fully support drnrg. It was a good read.
zoupzuop2 wrote:Mm. If I recall right, Warner really pushed compilations with Akyr's music on it. While I'm not sure if Akyr is dead or just in hiatus, it's clear that Warner doesn't regard Eurobeat to be dead if it's dealt with Akyr this recently. It's a HUGE label, pretty much the same size as Avex.
OK, understood. XD
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Post by #Infinity » 23 Jul 2008, 06:17

Maybe Super Eurobeat is in a bit of a financial slump at the moment, but that doesn't mean AVEX should give up. It's not the end at all; it's the beginning more than anything. The beginning of eurobeat becoming more widespread and accessible. With so many labels, including new ones, taking the genre by force, I can just feel a fresh new start to the journey of eurobeat. And even if AVEX doesn't keep Super Eurobeat alive forever, there's always hope that a new series will arise to succeed it. Eurobeat Fantasy and That's Eurobeat were quite popular in the late 80's, but they stood aside once Super Eurobeat began to rise to power in the early 90's, and the labels featured (TIME and Saifam) continued on (well, Saifam had a brief hiatus, but that didn't stop them from making a comeback to the eurobeat scene in 1995, similar to Leonardi with SinclaireStyle).
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Post by DJ Mike TJG » 23 Jul 2008, 07:17

Can I have a forum feature which blocks out ALL content talking about "SEB ending at 200" please? :???:

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Post by zoupzuop2 » 23 Jul 2008, 07:49

Had a big post ready to respond to this. But I'm too tired, so I'll say this:

To deny discussion of the end of something fantastic is as immature as covering your ears and saying "LALALALALALALALAAAAAA~". It may happen, it may not. If it does, it gives us the chance to witness something BETTER rise from the ashes.
The labels may do something on their own, or we the fans may have to do something about it. REGARDLESS, there ARE other compilations.

Live with it. I'm going to sleep.
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Post by DJ Mike TJG » 23 Jul 2008, 08:23

I'm not denying you anything, I'm just amused that there's so much conjecture on this subject. Who decided so intently that 200 was going to be the number SEB finishes on anyway?

Still, kudos for putting it in a separate thread!

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Post by SuperEuroJimmy » 23 Jul 2008, 13:18

200 is a stupid number to end SEB. 192 is a lot better! >: (

(hihi just kidding)

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Post by Cosmic_Bard » 23 Jul 2008, 17:00

If it happens, it probably won't be a nice round number since that would denote some sort of plan to end it.

Except for severe sudden financial distress (someone crashes a plane into Avex HQ) or some other random mitigating factor, I can't see Avex wanting to end the series for any reason. Just doesn't make sense. Dismantling a project and reassigning all those involved is a lot of work and even more money.

Here's hoping for SEB 500, many decades from now.
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Post by pokecapn » 23 Jul 2008, 22:15

Why are all of you rooting for Avex so much? I'd be much happier if Avex lost its grip on the labels and they were allowed to market to the internet or other companies as much as they wanted to. Don't you want to see more things like the Eurobeat Masters compilations, or are you pleased as punch that Avex sits on a zillion A Beat-C, Time, and SCP tracks, never to release them?

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