Super Eurobeat 221 (News in page 1!)

Everything that is eurobeat can be discussed here.
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Valianttrust
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Post by Valianttrust » 01 Feb 2012, 01:24

I don't think Lebon is outright saying, "Don't buy the albums." I think he is merely expressing the want for more labels/artists to directly release their work through juno or so on instead of paying for inflated prices of cd albums.
Am I right?
And I personally do not see anything wrong with directly giving support to the labels/artists through online distribution rather than expensive cd albums anyway.

zoupzuop2
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Post by zoupzuop2 » 01 Feb 2012, 01:31

Valianttrust wrote:I don't think Lebon is outright saying, "Don't buy the albums." I think he is merely expressing the want for more labels/artists to directly release their work through juno or so on instead of paying for inflated prices of cd albums.
Am I right?
And I personally do not see anything wrong with directly giving support to the labels/artists through online distribution rather than expensive cd albums anyway.
Not all of the labels have that luxury. By all means, if you just want the labels to survive, and they have that kind of option available, go for it. But if you want Super Eurobeat— the compilation— to survive, where else would the money go?
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Tiger
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Post by Tiger » 01 Feb 2012, 03:10

I don't think there are many people who make a good living on just digital download sales alone as the only source of income... Promotion/Advertising is the hardest part.

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Post by Jay » 01 Feb 2012, 06:32

I'm not Lebon14's biggest fan, but I always find it amusing when people chastise him for "killing eurobeat" considering I know that some of you have pirated eurobeat before and, thus, have contributed to the potential demise of SEB (albeit to differing degrees). The lack of human accountability for anything that goes wrong in the world nowadays, whether it be something as big as global warming or as small as the end of your favourite eurobeat compilation, really astonishes me.
Tiger wrote:I don't think there are many people who make a good living on just digital download sales alone as the only source of income... Promotion/Advertising is the hardest part.
You're making a false assumption that the promotion of physical sales is easier; not only is that just as hard but far more expensive.

On a semi-related note, I really wish people would stop assuming that the producers are feeding their families and living off the teet of the meager profits that SEB provides them. Most of the producers have other jobs because SEB alone—no matter how much Avex has promoted it—was never profitable enough for them to make a so-called "decent living" out of, and that's not going to change in the near future, I guarantee it. We can only begin discussing a way forward once you all get past this fantasy that eurobeat used to be a gold mine for the producers and it can be that way again by screaming at the fans to import more albums from Japan. Sorry zoupzuop2, but you're dreaming if you seriously think that's going to happen.

There needs to be legal consequences for people who download and upload eurobeat material illegally, especially those who do it on a large scale. That's the only way things are going to change. Naturally, if there are such legal deterrents in place, it will promote and facilitate the legal avenues to purchasing eurobeat; those who can't afford it will just have to get over it. Sure, some people are always going to find ways to worm their way around the law, but it's a step in the right direction. I'm hopeful that something like ACTA will help stop the problem.

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Lebon14
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Post by Lebon14 » 01 Feb 2012, 09:06

Valianttrust wrote:I don't think Lebon is outright saying, "Don't buy the albums." I think he is merely expressing the want for more labels/artists to directly release their work through juno or so on instead of paying for inflated prices of cd albums.
Am I right?
And I personally do not see anything wrong with directly giving support to the labels/artists through online distribution rather than expensive cd albums anyway.
Yeah exactly. I didn't say "I won't buy albums ever!". Heck, I bought Eurobeat Forever Vol.1, all Disko Warp's Speedisko albums, I do possess some original eurobeat albums from Avex and bought several digital releases before beside those I mentionned. Also, I don't mind buying CDs, in fact, I like that when I like the content. I would be more inclined to buy Eurobeat if more money would go to the labels. I don't think Avex is giving 90% of the profit to the labels. If that would be the case, I would be buying every single CDs out there on CD Japan whenever I can because I know that most of my money would go to the producer and not Avex. That's only what I wanted to say from the beginning.
Jay wrote:I'm not Lebon14's biggest fan, but I always find it amusing when people chastise him for "killing eurobeat" considering I know that some of you have pirated eurobeat before and, thus, have contributed to the potential demise of SEB (albeit to differing degrees). The lack of human accountability for anything that goes wrong in the world nowadays, whether it be something as big as global warming or as small as the end of your favourite eurobeat compilation, really astonishes me.
Thanks for the backup even if I know that well, you don't really like me. I don't remember the last "freshly" release SEB I shared.
Jay wrote:On a semi-related note, I really wish people would stop assuming that the producers are feeding their families and living off the teet of the meager profits that SEB provides them. Most of the producers have other jobs because SEB alone—no matter how much Avex has promoted it—was never profitable enough for them to make a so-called "decent living" out of, and that's not going to change in the near future, I guarantee it. We can only begin discussing a way forward once you all get past this fantasy that eurobeat used to be a gold mine for the producers and it can be that way again by screaming at the fans to import more albums from Japan. Sorry zoupzuop2, but you're dreaming if you seriously think that's going to happen.
Thank you for saying that! It's not just for eurobeat but every underground genres! People produce and sell the music in hope of making some money but have to back it up with a real job.
Jay wrote:I'm hopeful that something like ACTA will help stop the problem.
If you want Internet to disappear as a whole, yes, be a supporter for ACTA. E-P is already infringing and could be shut-down any time. Why? The lyrics. The album covers. Yes. Those could be the demise of E-P under ACTA cause it breaks the copyright law. Don't wish for it. You don't want it to happen. You don't want to be monitored for everything you do. You don't want to be censored when you talk politics. You don't want it to happen, I don't want it either. So, careful with those wishes.
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Vadim
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Post by Vadim » 01 Feb 2012, 16:58

To narrow all the problems down to a piracy issue is a rather shallow approach.
Observing the general improvements generated by special collections on US Itunes, it is not difficult to discern the obvious..
Going international for any brand new SEB would remedy the digital losses, at least to an extent.
Keep in mind, vast majority of nations can't get SEB in affordable digital form legally. Cuz it is available only to Japan and they can't get it in their countries.
While americans or canadians seem to get SEB as cd's much easier, it remains rather an impossibility to many people in other countries to import such a cd from Japan. So, it is not as simple..

We also have a large number of hardcore fans who left cuz they were dissapointed in excessive genre experiments in SEBs of 200-ds era. That's why it was suggested to get music back to more classic form so this hardcore fan base could be consolidated. It was expected to happen starting with SEBs 221.
Many ppl expect eurobeat to get gold once again. All it takes is a record company must provide an opportunity for italian teams to deliver their new powerfull music that will get those guys going once more.

The main focus here must be a record company.
That's why it is far more essential to deal with a problem right now.
Fans and producers should get in touch with Avex and to ask them to restart the SEB asap. If Avex sees a passion and desire from your side to restart it, it may help to make it happen.

It probably is inapropriate to revert to gossip, but some japanese sources mention that eurobeat is in hiatus because of Avex Staff changes and label internal politics.
Last edited by Vadim on 01 Feb 2012, 17:19, edited 1 time in total.

zoupzuop2
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Post by zoupzuop2 » 01 Feb 2012, 17:07

Jay wrote:On a semi-related note, I really wish people would stop assuming that the producers are feeding their families and living off the teet of the meager profits that SEB provides them. Most of the producers have other jobs because SEB alone—no matter how much Avex has promoted it—was never profitable enough for them to make a so-called "decent living" out of, and that's not going to change in the near future, I guarantee it. We can only begin discussing a way forward once you all get past this fantasy that eurobeat used to be a gold mine for the producers and it can be that way again by screaming at the fans to import more albums from Japan. Sorry zoupzuop2, but you're dreaming if you seriously think that's going to happen.
I can't seem to find the part in my original post in which I said that the producers/labels themselves were doing so outright well that it'd feed their entire families. My focus was largely on Super Eurobeat as a compilation, as its own unit. The producers could be serving tea or raising honey badgers for a living on the side, for all I know (on the other hand, I can guarantee it's a hell of a lot easier when these folks ARE being paid, from the sales of Super Eurobeat, to make MORE Eurobeat). Hell, why else would they take on several genres? I know for a fact that Ritmo & Blu (SCP's studio) takes on clients of all genres, as did Rodgers Studio. What the producers choose to do to supplement their income, good on them. SEB sales may not have been incredibly profitable to the SEB producers themselves (thought maybe Night of Fire and some of the "grand slams" might have been nice boons), but they sure as hell would do some good for SEB itself.

I do notice that I forgot the "Super" in one of the later parts of my post, which makes it a statement about the genre instead of the compilation... I'll modify it to read 'SEB'. I know that Eurobeat would not die, in whole, if we were to lose this compilation. But I also know that it would be dealt a very significant blow for it to lose one of its most important compilations.

My whole main point was, if I may borrow the bolded part: "Either Super Eurobeat is making money or it is dying." That's the compilation. They can't release an album without money to cover the expenses of releasing an album. If people don't want to see the COMPILATION anymore, then obviously we're on the right track.

[Also, I wasn't trying to point a finger at Lebon, my use of "it wasn't X/money goes y" was to pinpoint complaints that are common to MOST places I go where people create excuses to take the albums without pay. Lebon, I understand you've been better about purchasing your albums, and if my post came across as directed towards you specifically, I would like to wholeheartedly apologize. That wasn't my intention.]

Lastly... consider that while I'm more than happy for content/copyright holders to have some more power on their hands, I don't believe in legislation that swats a fly with a nuclear warhead. ACTA, SOPA, PIPA and all sorts of other four-letter words being passed around the world serve more harm to the internet than good to content providers (and would assume that those who DO pirate on a large scale won't just find ways around it).
A lot's changed in the decade and a half I've been here.
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Shinraikan
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Post by Shinraikan » 02 Feb 2012, 09:26

I think a lot of it has to do with if the producers that have been there for years are still willing to make the music. Everyone knows the "sound" that these producers make, whether it be Castagna, Gelmetti, or whatever. Most of them have been there for a very, very long time and they know what they're doing. At least half of them seem to be wary of any newcomers to the playing field. I'm not saying they're partially to blame for "killing eurobeat" but it's certainly not growing as a genre when people are so set in their ways. I definitely can't speak for these people but it seems like some of them just want to keep doing it their way and others want to expand but can't because of Avex. It just seems like something that we can really help. I don't know how.

I brought up the idea of Eurobeat Forever half a year ago to push eurobeat forward in a new direction while trying to retain the quality and sound that we all know and love. I've met some really cool people that make great music but haven't been part of "mainstream" eurobeat for the most part. But what is mainstream anyway? Can we consider EBF to be one of the big albums yet? Probably not for a while. This was really just an off-shoot of the Eurobeat Prime Underground podcast that Travis did a great job doing voice-overs for. It never really went much farther after that, but the point I'm trying to make is, we can all do our part whether it be making music or buying it. Our sales have been pretty good. Nothing phenomenal but good. Who knows how the next album will go. Better because of the publicity? Worse because people already feel like they chipped in? I dunno. If people stopped purchasing our compilation, I'm sure none of us would stop making eurobeat but it would put a damper on things. This goes double, triple, quadruple, etc. for Super Eurobeat. But it really is a matter of if those producers or Avex are willing to put their time into it.

You have to admit, those guys are getting pretty old and eurobeat could very well die out if we don't start hearing from new producers.

Valianttrust
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Post by Valianttrust » 02 Feb 2012, 16:03

Shinraikan wrote: Everyone knows the "sound" that these producers make, whether it be Castagna, Gelmetti, or whatever. Most of them have been there for a very, very long time and they know what they're doing. At least half of them seem to be wary of any newcomers to the playing field.
They are wary of new talent? Where did this idea come from? :???:

drnrg
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Post by drnrg » 03 Feb 2012, 01:49

A lot of Eurobeat priducers have been known to powst on the forums. The fact that not one has manmtioned anything about the cancellation of SEB, gives me hope. I think they feel enough at home on the forums to be able to mention something ,if anything about the future of Eurobeat.
I'm also surprised darksky hasn't been able to shed more light on the subject? I think everybody is jumping the gun on the subject.

and I'm kinda tired of seeing the piracy subject brought up everyTIME. I buy the SEB cds cause I want to posses them, but as far as Extendeds for other labels like FLEA, TIME, ASIA(not all appear on purchase site) I'll aquire then any way I can. Download, trade, whatever. Tru story. The original vynal versions of HRG Atrtaclks first recordes are no featured on Eurobeat flash. Those are some watered down versions. Those of you who collect SEB also know that The versions to Mega NRG Man- Dog Eat Dog and Maio & Co. Bye Bye baby are not the full extended versions There are countless others, but my point is that those old vinyl extended can someTIMES only be aquired from Vinyl rips that other fans upload. So linching one member for downloading Eurobeat seems pretty unfair, when at one TIME or another, eveyrone has done it. Unless you are some kinda saint or something?

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otter87
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Post by otter87 » 04 Feb 2012, 23:29

The way you're all typing heated, dissertation-sized posts speculating and ranting when avex still hasn't released any information the entire time, lol.

DarkSky
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Post by DarkSky » 07 Feb 2012, 22:33

I don't ''think'' we should be that worried about Eurobeat's future. No really, I don't.

coco*tapioka
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Post by coco*tapioka » 08 Feb 2012, 02:01

Wasn't one of the points said in the Vol. 200 DVD that no matter how bad it sells, the series will go on?

drnrg
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Post by drnrg » 09 Feb 2012, 04:05

DarkSky
I don't ''think'' we should be that worried about Eurobeat's future.
This made my day. :D

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Post by DarkSky » 09 Feb 2012, 20:27

drnrg wrote:DarkSky
I don't ''think'' we should be that worried about Eurobeat's future.
This made my day. :D
There are some positives signs, yes. Definitely.
It's not over.

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